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chipmaster
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Sweet Home 3D usability


Chipmaster,

Most probably this "problem" is not a problem.

Try this, and do it exactly in this order:
- draw you walls
- insert your doors
- draw your floor

If you do things in this order, the door makes a hole in the wall, and the floor fills half that hole.
If you first draw the floor, and then insert the doors, the floor isn't adapted to the inserted door, and the ground colour or texture is visible.

Hans

Hans, I suggest to create intuitive user interface and logic as far as possible. I understand this rule as a developer but I don't understand it as a common user. If this sequence can be done by user using standard UI, why it can't be done inside the program automatically? I think common user should not know that there is a right order. Or maybe it makes sence to add some "foolproof"

[Note from moderator: I split the thread "Sweet Home 3D 3.0" because this thread is already quite big already]
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Puybaret at Nov 25, 2010 3:23:22 PM]
[Nov 25, 2010 12:40:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Puybaret
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

Hans won't be able to answer to you on this one since he's not the programmer of Sweet Home 3D (no offense Hans wink).
Until now and probably for a long time, plan items are not bound to each other in Sweet Home 3D and I wouldn't like to reopen this subject. On the developer side, this is much simpler to program as you seem to guess it, but it lets me more time to program other features. On the user side, this gives some freedom since the user doesn't need to remember the logic of objects that would be bound to each other, but on the other side he may have to change some items when he moves/changes other ones.
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Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer
[Nov 25, 2010 12:57:46 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
hansmex
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

Chipmaster,

My answer to your question is a bit different than Emmanuel's answer.

1 - What is intuitive? Every person has a different opinion about it. So far you are the first person (as far as I know) to complain about the intuitiveness of the SH3D user interface. The comments on this forum confirm this, the questions asked here confirm it, the reviews in blogs confirm it: SH3D is by far the easiest-to-use 3D design program.
2 - Even so, every program has a learning curve, however shallow it may be. That's why there's a manual, there are tutorials, there's a forum where questions are answered as fast as possible, and where we try to solve problems as good as possible. And, where the chief developer, Emmanuel, listens carefully to the wishes of users: new features are implemented at an astonishingly rapid pace.
3 - For people who find certain features missing, there's the possibility to extend the usability of SH3D by programming plug-ins. One of these plug-ins even enables you to adapt floors/ceilings in great detail. Using this plug-in you can change floors in such a way that they fill the floor-gaps of doors.

Hans
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Dual boot - AMD FX6300 6-core, 16GB ram
Windows 10 Pro, SH3D 6.2 with 8 GB memory allowance
Ubuntu 18.04, SH3D 6.2 with 2 GB memory allowance
[Nov 25, 2010 1:20:09 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
chipmaster
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

Hans, I agree with you, SH3D is the easiest to use 3D design program! But not an ideal unfortunatelysmile.
People often organize a Usability testing for big projects: create several GUI, invite several groups of people, provide them tasks and see how people do it. Whether they will achieve success or not, how fast, etc... It costs a lot of money and takes a lot of time and therefore doesn't make sense.
I see how my friends and my mother work with SH3D: they create walls, create room, then add doors. First time I did the same.
[Nov 25, 2010 2:52:06 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
hansmex
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

Chipmaster,

Guess what.. I have a legal (as in "paid for") license for TurboCad 3D. I'll make a special price for you, as I never use it.

After you've paid, we'll discuss which has the better user interface... laughing

Hans
----------------------------------------
Dual boot - AMD FX6300 6-core, 16GB ram
Windows 10 Pro, SH3D 6.2 with 8 GB memory allowance
Ubuntu 18.04, SH3D 6.2 with 2 GB memory allowance
[Nov 25, 2010 3:07:00 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
macfrog
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

hi everyone who is reading...

i dunno, where this is starting from, but a would like to add my dislikes for the IMHO misunderstanding, someone or everyone is designing a project by following the "suggested rule of howto do so" from the developer, as it aint so.

Try this, and do it exactly in this order:
- draw you walls
- insert your doors
- draw your floor

for me, as i'm trying to create my NEW home, i would NEVER start with walls. would be stupid, anyway. Instead, i try to imagine the size of every room or space i would require, then draw those rooms with some space around it.
after that, i move those room-areas around until i found a nice layout and THEN, AFTER THAT, i start creating walls (with different thickness, dep. upon place and needs, e.g. insulation).
placing the doors later lets them standing on 0 but you can fix that by adding 1 cm, so whats the problem (you'll need a door step anyway!)? certainly, i could still remove the older rooms and redo them, which is happen often anyway (for the ceiling lights).
macfrog
[Nov 25, 2010 9:57:36 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Puybaret
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

Hey guys, don't ask too much to a free software developed by one person and designed for interiors layout.
You can use Sweet Home 3D as an architecture software if you want to (I mean by "architecture" the design of new homes from scratch), but then don't blame it if you find the interiors layout logic doesn't fit your needs. And don't expect too much features targeted to architecture in the coming months, there's still a lot to be done for the layout of existing homes.
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Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer
[Nov 25, 2010 10:25:35 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
hansmex
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

Chipmaster, Macfrog,

For those people who prefer to start drawing the rooms, and build the walls afterward, there's this feature:
- click the Floors button and draw your room;
- click the Walls button;
- double-click the room and the walls will automatically surround the room.
This feature is interesting if you want to design just one room.

However nice this feature is, this way of designing a house has some serious drawbacks:
- when drawing multiple rooms, walls between rooms will not line up properly;
- adjacent rooms will not share walls;
- giving rooms exact measures is very difficult using just the mouse.
This last drawback can be circumvented using the AdvancedEdit plug-in.

Together these drawbacks will make your plans next to useless for any serious design work, as no contractor can use such a plan with approximate measures, nor can you reliably do any planning of furniture, kitchen, bathroom, etc.

I have been an interior designer for 10 years, and I think I know what I'm talking about. If you want to do some initial designing, the best way is to use pen and paper. Make some sketches, erase what you don't like, move walls around as much as you like until you are more or less satisfied. Every architect and designer I ever had to deal with works this way. They can't all be wrong. Once you are satisfied with your rough sketches, you can make a first 3D plan. But be prepared that you will have to erase (parts of) it, and start all over several times.

If on the other hand you strongly prefer to work in 3D, my guess would be that Google SketchUp is a much better alternative. It allows you to easily generate the volume of your new house, and from there work inwards, designing the rooms. The good news is that it's free, the bad news is that the learning curve is a bit steeper.

And, please, don't compare the two, because it's not fair: SH3D is like a one-man-band, while Google is a large symphony orchestra.

Hans
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Dual boot - AMD FX6300 6-core, 16GB ram
Windows 10 Pro, SH3D 6.2 with 8 GB memory allowance
Ubuntu 18.04, SH3D 6.2 with 2 GB memory allowance
[Nov 25, 2010 11:46:42 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
chipmaster
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

I followed instructions. Then I desided to adjust door size. Same picture will be if I move the door. (Note: door is situated between two rooms. Ground has green texture)


Instructions didn't help me for the doors between room and environment:


Guys, I really like this program and I take my hat off to Puybaret. I now how many tasks and feature requests you have to do. I'm under impression of your working process and support.

Puybaret, community and I just inform you about this bug and you can decide is it important or not.
[Nov 26, 2010 3:36:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Puybaret
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Re: Sweet Home 3D usability

chipmaster, I'm aware of this problem, but as said earlier, plan items are not bound to each other (except walls connected at each end), so until I'll change that, you'll have to edit the room item each time you change the door. wink
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Emmanuel Puybaret, Sweet Home 3D developer
[Nov 26, 2010 3:43:34 PM] Show Printable Version of Post    View Member Profile    Send Private Message    Hidden to Guest [Link] Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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